# Allow delegated gotchis to receive XP **URL:** \ **Category:** Ideas\ **Created:** [August 31, 2022, 2:40am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348 "2022-08-31T02:40:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![FrogByte](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/frogbyte/32/2800_2.png) [@FrogByte](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/FrogByte)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2022, 2:40am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/1 "2022-08-31T02:40:35Z")
Gotchis can be delegated to smart contracts like the GotchiVault. Until recently gotchis delegated to a smart contract received XP so long as the owner of the contract voted as they were the one with the voting power associated with the gotchi. There was a change recently that took away XP being delivered even if the current manager of voting power from gotchi voted. This was done without notification, discussion, or voting - this goes against the reason why a DAO exists. Delegated management is a large selling point and taking this away will have long term impacts and implications on the economy. This will also impact the ability to bring in new money as not every investor wants to actively play. We should seriously consider the long term impact of preventing delegated gotchi voting power and xp rewards. ---
**Author:** ![Moon](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/moon/32/1699_2.png) [@Moon](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/Moon)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2022, 8:11am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/2 "2022-08-31T08:11:05Z")
There was never any XP given out to Vault depositors unless they voted on proposals themselves. XP is a measure of how active someone is in the DAO / how well someone keeps up with current events (Community Calls, Minigames, etc.) so it makes perfect sense not to reward inactive people with it. ---
**Author:** ![HARDKOR](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/hardkor/32/1957_2.png) [@HARDKOR](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/HARDKOR)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2022, 1:29am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/3 "2022-09-01T01:29:53Z")
> [@Moon](#): > > There was never any XP given out to Vault depositors I think there was, at the beginning… it was in the original adverts for the vault, back when it had three features, staking, voting, and petting for you 🙂 If thats not right… people were not only mad for a year about something that stopped hapening, they were mad about something that never happened. And of course, for full irony… here we are now 😃 GG actual facts, GG. ---
**Author:** ![FrogByte](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/frogbyte/32/2800_2.png) [@FrogByte](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/FrogByte)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2022, 2:45am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/4 "2022-09-01T02:45:06Z")
> [@Moon](#): > > There was never any XP given out to Vault depositors unless they voted on proposals themselves. XP was given out for voting of deposited gotchis until recently. > [@Moon](#): > > XP is a measure of how active someone is in the DAO / how well someone keeps up with current events (Community Calls, Minigames, etc.) so it makes perfect sense not to reward inactive people with it. There is a difference between DAO voting and participating in community events (type form required events). Voting should be rewarded for voting power used. Delegated voting is not a new concept in crypto (DPoS, delegated validators) nor in other markets (ex. delegated stock voting rights). I invested in gotchi and have opted to take on counter party risk to delegate my vote to a group I’m involved with and is aligned with my views and perspectives for this project. To say I’m not active is inaccurate and unfair. As an investor I should be able to delegate my voting power to a party I have deemed I trust to vote for me. I have commitments that take me away for periods of time and I would not have tied up as much ETH as I have in this project had I not had the option to delegate voting. For this ecosystem to grow we need to attract more than the hardcore enthusiasts who will be at every event and make a system that fairly rewards them for their invested assets they own - delegated or not. The GotchiVault allowed me to have gotchis in minimally connected multisig wallets that could still contribute voting power, and be rewarded for it, without storing a bunch of high value assets in a hot wallet. We need to be inclusive to all types of users not a specific type a subgroup deems more important and have a fair reward mechanism for voting. ---
**Author:** ![Quincy1971](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/quincy1971/32/3111_2.png) [@Quincy1971](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/Quincy1971)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2022, 12:10pm UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/5 "2022-09-02T12:10:33Z")
From my understanding, it was mentioned that deposited gotchi in the vault would receive TYPEFORM XP but was later changed to them having to fill out the forms because other gotchi owners were upset that they were receiving “free xp”. This reason right here is why non custodial is imo the best way to go because PC never said that depositors would get XP. Not to sound like a penis but the Vault also said that listing your gotchi through them would get you all your alchemica and all your upfront GHST and that has not worked out either. So are we now to reimburse you for your lost GHST also? ---
**Author:** ![FrogByte](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/frogbyte/32/2800_2.png) [@FrogByte](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/FrogByte)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 2:33am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/6 "2022-09-03T02:33:11Z")
> [@Quincy1971](#): > > From my undetstanding, it was mentioned that deposited gotchi in the vault would receive TYPEFORM XP This was never the case to my knowledge as Typeforms were for community event participation. > [@Quincy1971](#): > > PC never said that depositors would get XP They never said they wouldn’t. They did give it to gotchis as long as the voting power was used, and then changed it. It was never voted on one way or the other and that is the point. > [@Quincy1971](#): > > Vault also said that listing your gotchi through them would get you all your alchemica and all your upfront GHST and that has not worked out either. So are we now to reimburse you for your lost GHST also? No one has implied nor suggested anyone be reimbursed. It would also be unnecessary as the Vault has provided all owed alchemical and GHST. This also, again, not the point. I’ll clarify: Delegated gotchis voting power is being used to vote in line with my views and perspective of the project. Those gotchis are now no longer getting XP for their used voting power yet they are contributing to the DAO via their voting power. I, as the assets owner, should be able to allow my assets vote to be executed by someone I have approved to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Quincy1971](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/quincy1971/32/3111_2.png) [@Quincy1971](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/Quincy1971)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2022, 12:12pm UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/7 "2022-09-03T12:12:03Z")
> [@FrogByte](#): > > They never said they wouldn’t. Hmm your argument is not really a strong one especially because it was an outside entity making (unsubstantiated) claims based on what they thought was going to happen. Also you should have at least quoted the entire sentence. > [@Quincy1971](#): > > From my understanding, it was mentioned that deposited gotchi in the vault would receive TYPEFORM XP but was later changed to them having to fill out the forms because other gotchi owners were upset that they were receiving “free xp”. Xp is an incentive for active participation in community events and governance. It is not something that is somehow “owed” to you because you have voting power. Voting power itself is simply the GHST value of the assets that you own. If you “opt-out” by delegating your voting power to a third party, which is clearly a choice and I for one still support delegated voting, you lose this incentive because you are not actively participating via the guidelines that have been established. Your voting power will still be used as you see fit but without the xp. IMO giving XP to “passive voters” will never pass based solely on the economic aspect of it being a category in Rarity Farming. Hmm now that i think about you may have brought up an interesting topic…how much xp was actually given to asset holders that were not actively participating and how many thousands of USD has been awarded to them during Rarity Farming? 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![FrogByte](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/frogbyte/32/2800_2.png) [@FrogByte](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/FrogByte)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2022, 4:44am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/8 "2022-09-04T04:44:10Z")
> [@Quincy1971](#): > > Hmm your argument is not really a strong one especially because it was an outside entity making (unsubstantiated) claims based on what they thought was going to happen. Also you should have at least quoted the entire sentence. This isn’t an argument. It was a response to an assumption you made and I quoted the part of the conjunction sentence where you used an assumption to then make an argument. The assumption is what I was explicitly responding too. > [@Quincy1971](#): > > Xp is an incentive for active participation in community events and governance. Correct; We agree. And my point is that my voting power is being actively used in governance and I should be rewarded as the owner of that voting power. My voting power is active it’s how we define activity that differs. > [@Quincy1971](#): > > IMO giving XP to “passive voters” will never pass based solely on the economic aspect of it being a category in Rarity Farming. Maybe, but we don’t know this for certain. This hasn’t been voted on and that is what is needed. The DAO should vote to make this decision. ---
**Author:** ![HARDKOR](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/hardkor/32/1957_2.png) [@HARDKOR](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/HARDKOR)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2022, 5:28am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/9 "2022-09-04T05:28:07Z")
Two things, just in case these weren’t part of your reasoning… 1. You can vote yourself, with at least crumbs of ghst in wallet, even if everything else is in vault. 2. In the full grande ironic nature of reality, the automation service forgets to vote sometimes. My personal take is that we’re going to have to evolve our tech anyways… would love to hear all the angles because Im deeply interested in finding ways humans can self govern without tyranny or trust. ---
**Author:** ![Quincy1971](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/quincy1971/32/3111_2.png) [@Quincy1971](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/Quincy1971)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2022, 2:27pm UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/10 "2022-09-04T14:27:41Z")
You are correct your response was not an argument but i am guessing more of a statement. What you actually did is called selective misquoting on a statement that was made but that is neither here nor there at this point. I agree with you about not actually knowing the DAO’s thought’s on whether they would like to award xp to asset owners that are not actually taking the time and voting themselves. IMO you should post a poll to gauge this. Again i am NOT opposed to delegated voting because it really helps most times with reaching quorum, however i believe xp should stay as an incentive for active participation. Granted your voting power is being used but it was actually given up for other services such as free petting for example. ---
**Author:** ![jarrod](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/jarrod/32/980_2.png) [@jarrod](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/jarrod)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2022, 12:35am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/11 "2022-09-07T00:35:15Z")
I don’t agree with the Aavegotchi protocol incentivising people to sell their voting power in exchange for services. If you care enough about XP, you should keep up with the DAO proposals and vote. ---
**Author:** ![FrogByte](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/frogbyte/32/2800_2.png) [@FrogByte](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/FrogByte)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2022, 1:56am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/12 "2022-09-10T01:56:50Z")
> [@jarrod](#): > > I don’t agree with the Aavegotchi protocol incentivising people to sell their voting power in exchange for services. I’m not selling voting power; I’m delegating. And I’m delegating to a manager that is voting in line with how I want my voting power, related to an assist I own, to be used. My assets have voting power; when that voting power is used I should be rewarded. This is similar to how Polygon PoS works. I delegate Matic to a node manager (validator). ---
**Author:** ![bringabong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@bringabong](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/bringabong)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2022, 5:33am UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/13 "2022-09-10T05:33:08Z")
The Gotchi protocol and the majority of the community wants people to be engaged this is why petting was a part of the design as it was fundamental to Tamagotchi … XP should be treated the same players must be engaged to obtain benefits other wise whats the point of having these rewards … If we removed XP and Kinship all together that would solve the argument but disadvantage the players who are engaged who should be looked after ahead of the remote hands off investor… ---
**Author:** ![aargh](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/aargh/32/2563_2.png) [@aargh](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/aargh)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2022, 1:30pm UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/14 "2022-09-11T13:30:02Z")
Seems like gotchigang’s most active users, as well as PC, are not a fan of vp delegation, let alone xp distribution to vaulted gotchis… I’m inclined to agree with Coderdan on anything gotchi-related, so I’m resigned to seeing proxy voting as icky, despite that I feel that it has potential. Still, I sense that people aren’t really thinking hard about this case, and are giving in to: lazy and lofty idealism; general FUD aimed at the VAULT; and even elitism in thinking that active users are vastly better than inactive ones. Perhaps people only care to reward active users when they feel that they are the most active themselves. Who are the active users? Who are the inactive users? Does anyone have any data on this at all? Why should we reward active users? Tell me, what good do active users do? Do inactive users contribute nothing to this ecosystem? Are we really this comfortable with leaving a nebulous, potentially large demographic of **OUR** investors feeling like they got rugged over XP? I guess I expected our active users to at least acknowledge the feelings of our frens, or to constructively explain how this case goes against our principles, but–even as the best DAO in the world–we don’t have an explicit set of principles for our investors to reference. I’m thankful for this thread, it’s like a big red flag embroidered with the words “GET A CONSTITUTION” ---
**Author:** ![HARDKOR](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/flex020/user_avatar/dao.aavegotchi.com/hardkor/32/1957_2.png) [@HARDKOR](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/u/HARDKOR)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2022, 4:53pm UTC](https://dao.aavegotchi.com/t/allow-delegated-gotchis-to-receive-xp/4348/15 "2022-09-11T16:53:22Z")
So, Ill bite… Getting xp was added, to get people to participate. The xp is a payment for your additional set of eyes on the proposition. Having people read and decide for themselves, is key to securing the protocol. XP is the bribe.