Quickswap Syrup pool & GHST-QUICK rewards

Hey frens,

As some of you know, Quickswap has decided to remove QUICK rewards for the stkGHST-QUICK pool - or most projects that aren’t part of their “Dragon’s Syrup” pools. I’ve seen a few frens sad about this, as stkGHST-QUICK has been our longest running LP pair and the FRENS rewards are much higher.

According to @coderdan (please correct me if I’m wrong ser) we could get our rewards back if we opted in for the Syrup program with $100k worth of GHST. Syrup pools are very similar to the extinction pools on Dinoswap: You deposit dQUICK (staked QUICK) and earn your share of the pool ($100k in GHST).

Pros

  • Strengthens our relationship with Quickswap
  • stkGHST-QUICK LPs don’t have to look for new pair
  • Secures QUICK rewards for the time being (including stkGHST-USDC)
  • Puts the DAO’s idle funds to use (currently 1.75m GHST & 1.75m DAI)

Cons

  • $100k investment
  • Haven’t received details / no clear communication by Quickswap
  • Could be argued that we’re artificially keeping a useless pair alive
  • Handing out GHST to dQUICK holders (their tokens aren’t burned, so different than DINO)

Disclaimer: I’m personally not a stkGHST-QUICK LP so I don’t really mind either way. But there have been some frens asking about it so here’s your chance to make your voices heard!

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I’d love to see stkGHST-USDC continue to be incentivized, but I really don’t see the point in a stkGHST-QUICK pair to be honest. In the last 7 days, USDC-GHST has about $6m in volume, and WETH-GHST has about $4m in volume.

QUICK-GHST on the other hand has about $1.5m in volume, and this is likely just arbitrageurs. There is very little organic demand for this particular pair, and so incentives are basically just rewarding LPers for doing nothing useful.

I think we should focus on providing incentives exclusively for pairs that would actually improve liquidity with pairs that people actually trade in, as this gives a tangible benefit to the overall ecosystem in terms of lower slippage. If QUICK decides to give a free or discounted large incentive for this pair, that’s awesome and we should take them up on it. But I think proposing that to QuickSwap is not a particularly good idea and makes us look hungry for incentives like beggars. If the Aavegotchi team proposes something, it should be an attractive offer to Quickswap. Just my two gwei.

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Here is an idea:
We propose Sushi to move all pools there, so they will have fees for their xsushi holders.
DAO can subsidise pools with 100k ghst a month and sushi can match that with sushi so pools will have double subsidise.

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“no clear communication by Quickswap” is a pretty big con. Good communication is the cost of entry for an upstart enterprise to be successful. It bodes poorly that they are poor communicators and arbitrarily just changed the rules. What will stop them from doing this again?

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I dont see a point for this pair. USDC and WETH are all you need honestly.

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There is already some discussion going on with Sushi as far as I know and it looks like we’ll incentivize the GHST-MATIC pair on there pretty soon.

https://snapshot.org/#/aavegotchi.eth/proposal/QmSwYHwbv9wUZbhZ1J7YK3pd2MexndjsR6B4yWKKg9KxP4

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It would be great if we could have an AMA with Quickswap. I would like to know if the treasury was to offer 100K USD of GHST, how much will they incentivise the USDC and QUICK pools?

I’m not too concerned about the stkGHST-QUICK pair, but the stkGHST-USDC pair I think is worth incentivising to maintain the liquidity.

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The single largest blocker has definitely been getting any sort of definitive numbers regarding potential syrup pools. Limiting our scope to stkGHST-USDC instead of QUICK may help and this thread so far indicates support for such.

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It depends on the rewards, and it might be good to review Dinoswap’s proposal to compare the benefits before deciding which is the better platform to put the 100k or even both

Additionally, I also think that we should rethink the FRENS rewards for the GHST-QUICK pair, and the philosophy behind FRENS rewarding in general. I think FRENS rewards should be targeted not solely based on impermanent loss, but instead more focused on rewarding liquidity pairs that provide the most value to Aavegotchi.

And so I argue that perhaps the FRENS rewards for GHST-QUICK should be reduced in accordance with the usefulness of the pair to the ecosystem. I don’t think GHST-QUICK should be rewarded more FRENS than GHST-ETH or GHST-USDC for example. The mindset of rewarding people for impermanent loss risk is, in my opinion, a product of a welfare state mindset. We should be promoting productivity in the ecosystem with FRENS rewards, and not rewarding people simply for taking on more risk.

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I think the problem with giving incentives to the syrup pools is that it is people with dquick that benefit, not those actively staking, so someone with zero connection with the project could potentially be farming 50% of the rewards and this doesn’t sit right with me.
If they’d implement rewards based on the original mechanism again, I’d be all for that

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Just as an update, Quickswap reduced the GHST-USDC rewards once again. They’re basically 0 now.

I thought I’d put up this thread to see if there are any people supportive of Quickswap’s proposal but it doesn’t look like it. Personally I really don’t like how they handle their partnerships either and would rather incentivize LPs on other platforms such as Sushiswap.

I think we don’t need much more discussion, pretty clear that the community does not want to take Quickswap up on their offer.

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I’ve reached out to the Quickswap team and encouraged them to join in the discussion here with a clear action plan!

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Truthfully the only reason I even staked in the pair was for the QUICK/FREN rewards in the beginning and I believe that many are still there for this reason. I am a firm believer in that people will show you by their actions the value that they see in you and their actions are sad in that we basically propped their site up in the beginning by providing a massive TVL for them. As it was mentioned before I really think we should look into others like SushiSwap ,who would possibly help subsidize a stkGHST-WMATIC farm they we could begin to consolidate the stkGHST-QUICK and stkGHST-ETH that we have on QuickSwap at this time consolidating the FREN rewards for both.

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I agree with what you’re saying fren. The quick ghst pair isn’t really serving us at this point. I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about how to revisit the frens rewarding mechanism myself and would love to hear how you see changes to it.

You had mentioned rewarding the frens to the pairs which help the ecosystem as a whole rather than those with higher IL risk.

How would you see this looking?

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If there was some reliable measure of organic volume, I would lean towards using that to calibrate FRENS rewards. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem like anything like this exists yet. To be clear, I don’t really advocate removing IL from consideration completely, but it should definitely not be the primary focus of FRENS rewards. There aren’t that many pairs to incentivize, so I think it may be okay to simply have the FRENS committee make the choice of whether a pair is worth incentivizing or not. I can imagine a reward system like this:

Baseline: 1 FREN/Day
Organic Trading Pair Reward (Based on FREN Committee input or snapshot vote): 0.2 FRENS/Day
IL Risk:

  • Low: 0.05 FRENS/Day
  • High: 0.1 FRENS/Day

With this scheme, the rewards for current and considered pairs would be as follows:

GHST: 1 FREN/Day
GHST/QUICK: 1.1 FRENs/Day
GHST/USDC: 1.25 FRENs/Day
GHST/ETH: 1.3 FRENs/Day
GHST/MATIC: 1.3 FRENs/Day

With this scheme, the most important factor for extra FRENS beyond the baseline will be whether the committee considers the pair an organic pair or not. Details are obviously open to changes, but I think this scheme would properly incentivize pairs based on their importance to the ecosystem, and provide a small amount of compensation for IL.

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Yeah, the taask force pretty much agrees with this idea, I also think we should consider both IL and how beneficial it is to Aavegotchi. I like simplicity and something along the lines of what you just proposed has definitely my full support @Mori .

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Will the FRENS taask force be pushing for this idea? I think that would be better than me promoting it myself.

Yeah, internally everyone seemed to agree with the idea, so very probably well do something along those lines. For now everything is on hold till the staking contract is upgraded by Pixelcraft, which should be happening soon TM. We’ll keep you posted, thanks for your contribution!

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