I think everyone should be responsible for their original investment, If it keeps deferred, then never increment is the best solution
I guess my initial reaction is lets keep on schedule, but I also see the validity in putting it on hold based on current market conditions. More importantly I think we should take this time to crystallize high level guiding principle that we can optimize towardsā¦ Maybe we can flush some of these trade offs out and come up with some optimization goals we can all rally behind.
1 Like
I fat-fingered a humble in GBM for 192 GHST andādespite the tickerāI am still not spooked by a 30 GHST humble. A GBM wouldnāt bother me at all, might even cause some to overpay for land 
But I guess now I sway to delaying, realizing how ticket holders would take the biggest hitāand no doubt there will be too many entriesā¦
Aavegotchis have been surviving and thriving even in this market. Maybe weāre holding ourselves to too high of a standard. Perhaps we made a mistake in timing the land auction, and we need to get off the pedestal and fix itāeven if that makes us look bad.
Iāve got smol bags for upcoming landā¦ I know Iāll be fineā¦ so Iāll have to vote to delay.
2 Likes
I would like to add as well, one thing that people possibly havenāt considered yet is whatās more important to them, the price of their assets or the yield?
I understand that asset inflation and its affect on price is not a pleasurable experience but its definitely not as bad when itās a high yielding asset. I do believe that lower asset prices bring new players too the eco system, players that need alch to build altars/harvestors etc and even invest in gotchiās. On a chart I guess this would be the accumulation phase, its where the smart money is made.
Expanding the player base is important, for me its much more important than asset prices in the long run, and I donāt mean scholars here either(no offence scholars). We need more players with deep pockets looking to set themselves up for the inevitable bull phase of the market. The kind of investors that have a bit of clout on twitter or the tubeā¦
Obviously I donāt want the market to get wrecked eitherā¦I have a fair bit of capital wrapped in a load of spacious parcelsā¦ but there are other projects doing land sales in this marketā¦ Illuvium did 71 million in land sales a week agoā¦ and iāve seen other project promoting land sales too.
Judging demand is very difficult in any market. But yea my argument would be cheaper asset prices on boards more players that then end up supporting the eco system from which we all benefit from via yields. It creates a sustainable economy and just gets more people talking about aavegotchiā¦
So to all you Land baronsā¦ does a higher more sustainable yield make up for a drawdown on asset prices?
3 Likes
You raise a good point. We want to attract big investors into the ecosystem. 100% agree fren. It is this very reason why massive dilution events are not ideal, especially when there isnāt huge demand.
A potential investor looks at the tokenomics of things. They see land prices today vs what they were. Then they see a huge inflation event. Then they see alchemica prices cratering.
We have to realise that in its current state, farming is essentially locked token staking. Burn your tokens today for yield tomorrow.
The current mood of the community with the loudest voices is to dilute and drive prices down. Thankfully, those loud voices do not represent the majority will based on voting power.
We really should be looking for ways to increase the value of everything we currently have. This rise in price will attract more entrants. Since we are not yet a fun game with people throwing money to play, we have to think in terms of investing, not gaming.
Think about yourself looking a project. You see a promising roadmap, but the prices of everything are dropping with more inflation on the way. Would you buy anything now? Or wait?
7 Likes
Well I would probably buy now because Iām an aavegotchi addict but I get your point.
Ok lets say harvesters go live, alch prices rebound and the wider market slows its decentā¦ We are still in a bear market with another 6 months to go before bottoming out. But people are making a nice yield on their landā¦ Is this not the opportune moment to have the land sale when there is a proven yield. The yield will draw investors in and create more demand for land, it would have to be marketed correctly.
This could be a big event that brings new investors into our eco system whilst the rest of the market is flounderingā¦
Also does the auction actually have a negative impact on price?.. I would say the raffle probably is worse for price than the auction rightā¦ When you give stuff away for the cost of a raffle ticket players are more inclined to dump it for a profit straight awayā¦ But if you actually bid on and win the auction on a piece of land your unlikely to dump it afterwards at a lossā¦ I agree its still a supply shock, but the yield would incentivise people not to sell at stupidly low prices.
Yield and location are probably two of the main factors that will decide the price of land parcelsā¦
Yea so interested in when people think would be the opportune moment to do the land sale, are we going to wait for the entire bear market to be behind us? I donāt think this is a good strategy personally.
1 Like
Could we potentially alleviate some of the concerns around price impact in the next auction by implementing a floor on the GBM? Humble would have a starting price of X, Reasonable Y, Spacious Z, The GBM would start there instead of 0ā¦ This would/could cause more parcels to go unsold, but then we could just raffle off the excess, this should help with the drop ticket prices also as it would off set some of the inflation we have experienced by having more available parcels/increasing the odds of winning something.
This would probably decrease the revenue from the auction.
3 Likes
If we do this and raffle off anything unsold, those raffled parcels will get dumped on the market and crash the floors.
Just schedule the remaining ones, for the day before round two, so it doesnt miss its chance at being surveyed. Thatās about as far in as you can go without making them be less appealing and itās just long enough for the people who decided they want those ones, to figure that out.
You know I always envisioned that this game would scale via land parcelsā¦ axie had 8 million players at the top of its heydayā¦ It did this by being able to scale because of the type of turn based game it wasā¦ so Axie eco system was fuelled from the bottom up by having massive inflation of the main in game asset.
Different story with aavegotchi rightā¦ā¦ it runs in real time hence your never going to get the same kind of scalability that axie hadā¦ not with Gotchiās anywayā¦ but it can scale through land parcelsā¦ You could have many times the number of land owners than gotchi ownersā¦
This means gotchis become a finite resource that are invaluable to land owners to claim their yieldsā¦
Pushing out land sales and on boarding more players is essential to the success of the eco systemā¦
Iām just trying to look at the big picture hereā¦ the game is great and will be a privilege to play but the ecosystem is more scalable than the game itself. Land owners only need to log in for a few minutes to harvest their land parcels, or employ someone else to do it. One scholar could be servicing multiple players with multiple land parcelsā¦ Land owners donāt even need to ever enter the gotchiverseā¦.
So I would liken land parcels to the bottom up economic model that axie used to scale their game and make it the success it was.ā¦ More land owners means better more sustainable yields and a vibrant rental market for gotchisā¦ sustainable yields will onboard more players in the form of land owners than the rpg game ever will. And itās scalable!! Land yields are the gateway drug into the gotchiverseā¦ā¦
Land should be inflationary up to a point and gotchis should be a finite resource that reflects the TVL of the whole eco systemā¦
Yea so this idea that increasing the value of land parcels by throttling supply is going to bring more people into the eco system is wrong, asset appreciation is a bi product of bringing more people into the eco system its not the main driver.
Sustainable yields is what we should be focused on and not asset prices.
3 Likes
Is it possible now to have an updated roadmap to understand what happens next? Do we go ahead and postpone everything until the bull market? Thank you
Maybe itās time we have a DAO core values discussion, and codify what our guiding principles really are, so that in trying times, we have something to reference, other than āfrom where I stand at this moment, this feels appropriateā, so we donāt end up on the news like that Solana DAO that voted to seize someoneās account.
A preliminary idea for a guideline that addresses this particular sore spot -
When scheduling asset release events, there is a grace period of 50% of the time until implementation, where delays and cancelations may be voted upon using normal procedure of 20% quorum. Inside that range, a supermajority of 51% quorum is required, as this would signify an āall hands on deckā emergency.
Other things we should codify -
The difference between protocol votes and gotchiverse votes and our intent with how that should relate to VP, so that as we evolve, we have a guiding principle.
Where do we draw the line on āautomationā?
What are our intents with regards to vote delegation, and the selling of votes?
Is there any situation where a community member can lose their use of their assets or VP for the protocol? What about for the verse or any other addition to the protocol?
2 Likes
We need a set of laws, such as respecting the original proposal and not easily overturning the original decision, which would damage the interests of investors
1 Like
Itās funny that you say that, since Dr Wagmi, the one who made the original proposal, said on discord that he supported the delay of the land auction.
It wasnāt āeasilyā over turned, it was voted for, the same way that the original proposal was.
1 Like
What if the metric for whether you can overturn a proposition, is that for every day we get closer to the scheduled event, you need +1% quorum.
1 Like
My suggestion for dilution events such as this is that PC gets the release ready from a tech perspective first. Then we have a vote. If the vote passes, then the event is scheduled for 2 weeks from the close of the core prop.
This way itās not reliant on another release (such as harvesters) that may be delayed and thereās very little time for market conditions to change as drastically as they have in the last 5 weeks for example.
2 Likes
Anyone want to discuss whatās best for the game rather than what it will do to Game NFTs we bought? I am here for fun, I wouldnāt have spent $1k of my hobby money on this if I was just being greedy.
I think the barrier to entry for most people who are interested in the game is having some interesting gameplay. Land auctions donāt really matter to me - when the next interesting bit of the game is released matters to me (and should matter to people who want more money to flood in to the game too).
2 Likes
I know which people want to talk about that 
Whatās your favorite topic? Iāll wind you up like a top and set you off to change the world. We need some fresh blood and fresh ideas. Those of us whoāve been trying to push the game part are really tired, and could use some inspiration again 
1 Like
Having been well invested in the Aavegotchi project for over a year now, following development closely and trying to be in a position to make informed decisions in all aspects of future gameplay ā¦I am currently evaluating my decision wether or not to place more capital into the project ā¦
I am suffering from asset value dilution and it does not feel to me that this will be enhanced by release of land in a difficult market ā¦The worst example is buying drop tickets at 12 GHST 3 months now seeing them on market for 2.5 GHST hurts ā¦Mystic NFTās falling from 6,000 to less than 2,000 GHST is painful enough ā¦
I have been banking on the idea player base would out pace or at least keep up with development this has not been happened ā¦
It is of some comfort that the rest of the market has suffered more than the GHST token but as an asset holder of Land, Equipment, Tiles, Installations and Tickets I am not sure I have not suffered more than the total marketā¦
In the past I have considered the floor to be the lowest price that any item is offered for in the market place now I have come to the realisation in a bear market is that it is actually more often the last selling price of any item.
Even though even that is not reliable as the asset may no longer have the same value in the marketā¦
I support @notorious_BTC in the view that it is better to support the positions of longer term participants in the Aavegotchi community rather than rolling over to give better value to the next wave ā¦ If we focus on making the game awesome and achieve this they will comeā¦
In summary yes to the Delay
8 Likes
Thank you @bringabong, you are not alone in feeling this way. Everyone supporting further dilution needs to read this post and realize that investment in this game will stop if we carrying on diluting assets without a matching rise in demand.
5 Likes